The Dean (of Student Success) Will Help You Now

As the Associate Vice President of Student Affairs and the Dean of Student Success and Graduation at the University of Wyoming,  Dr. Nycole Courtney's mission is to provide. Full Stop. To provide students with any and all manner of support necessary to adjust to the academic rigors and personal struggles students can experience when adjusting to college life. We should all be so lucky as to have someone like Dr. Courtney as our advocate.

Transcript

This transcript was generated using speech-to-text technology. The accuracy may vary in spots.

Authentic Wyoming with Nycole Courtney ~ published February 27, 2024

Hi, I'm Myra. And I'm Tressa. We are fancy marketing people with union. A Wyoming-based telecommunication company. Yes, Wyoming really does exist. We proudly serve the Rocky Mountain region. On this podcast, we will feature businesses, organizations, non-profits, and influential people from Utah, Colorado, and Wyoming.

 Our mission is to highlight those who inspire their communities daily. We believe this makes us truly authentic because a journey of a thousand miles always begins with a single step. 

Hey, Myra. Hello. I'm just gonna keep saying good morning.

I guess it's still good morning. 1025. Yeah, it's a long, long way.

 Not even a long day.

 It's a long season. It would be. It would be a long season if you're always stuck. Good morning. Do you ever move to afternoon or evening? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm more productive in the morning. So maybe that's. Maybe that's why I feel like I'm really getting it today. Is my four-year anniversary at work.

That's right. Congratulations. Thank you. Yeah. I can't believe it. It feels like an eternity.

Eternity? Yeah. Four years. Yeah. If it's longer than four years in a good way, not in a bad way. Well, I like my job. Don't fire me. Yeah, that's like. I don't know how to take that. No, it's all good things. It's good things.

It feels like because there's just been so much change. Yeah. Some good things that have happened and growth. It feels like it's been a lifetime instead of just a short period of time. Yeah, well, that's one thing you can always count on if you're working at Union Constant change. Yeah. So if you like stability, you like everything static. That's not the job for you.

 How long have you been at Union? Is it 27? I think it's 27. I think it'll be 28. What? Your start. 96. Yeah, it'll be 20, right? Yeah. Because it's the year of your born. Just for my. I don't feel old at all. My entire life span I have worked it. Yeah, well it make me feel real good today.

 I mean, you are wonderful. Yeah. So and so, you know, fire me twice. Know you're battin’  a thousand. You know, I'm like, bang. Well, this is my final episode, everyone. Okay, so I had to be the final episode.

Yeah, And this is the last time you'll see me enjoy it.Y eah. And I'm joking. I understand. Yeah, understand. I mean, when I started, we were just starting into wireless. Wireless was just starting to become a thing, right? And it was back one bag phones. So, I mean, I've seen so much change. You know, I think my dad didn't pass a really long time, did he? Yeah. Yeah, It was in our minivan.

Yeah. And that thing was dusty, I bet. How do you clean this? Better than the car, Like in the console of a minivan with children? Yeah. How do you even keep that clean? I have no idea. I don't think you do it just now. Is it like a Carhartt jacket? And, like, I kind of think of car jackets, like. Like a cast iron skillet. Yeah, You just this season, you got a lot of season, so, like, it's good to be back. Yeah.

Yeah, it's perfect. It just makes it a little more rustic quality. But it's all that, you know, the other day, like comparing this to you, just season it. Yeah. So. All right, Susan, your bag phone you say is in your bag Phone.

That's how you keep. I wonder if they'll come back. Everything else is coming back on. I don't think so. What, Carrying a backpack with your. Yeah.
Your baby on Tuesday Say yeah. And then the fold on the back.

That's the way I always connect. That's probably not going to reappear. But who knows? Never say never. We should.

We should do a spoof like we're bringing them back.

We should have delirious. That'd be a funny April Fools. Yeah. Prank watch for that counterprotest. We're bringing it back. Go back for taking it way back. Yeah. we should do that for the 100. Is it 124 years? Next year is 110. 110. Wow.

2024 is where I got my math. Science is good. And some numbers into there. Yeah, that'd be really funny. I have great ideas. I can't wait to close down. I know. I think we I was inspiring storm for that. So yeah I've got the whole the game. Wow. There you go. Here we go. Well, for those who listen and those who also will see your advertisement, I really just pulled it for you.

So. Yeah, I ruined it. Or we may not do it. You never know. So stay tuned to. I'm just going to. There's no choice. Watch for this. Yeah.

ool. Well, I'm sorry. We've been very giddy, so we so happy to have our guests here. Yeah, we are with this. We have the lovely Dr. Nicole Courtney. She's the associate vice president and associate vice president of student affairs and the dean of Student Success and Graduation at the University of Wyoming. 

Hello. Hi, Nicole. Good morning, ladies. What a fun time. I'm so excited to be with you and beyond. Thankful for the opportunity to just engage and have a nice dialog with really amazing humans who care deeply about students. So just beyond thrilled to be here. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. So to start, can you just dive into your title like, hello Queen or, you know, like, okay, like this is happening.

So if you want to start there, can you break it down? Are they separate or do they coincide? You know, how does this work? Yeah, they're actually they're both together. And you guys, I found my dream job, which is like, hard, right? You when you find your dream job and you guys talking about working and having your four year anniversary, it just feels nice when you feel like you're at your own place.

You have a sensible longing and you are like, Yes, this feels dynamite. I feel really great. I have an amazing team, both administrative team above me, teammates beside me and my colleagues work, and then

just folks that work within our office are also amazing and it's been a real pleasure. I've only been in my role for about three years and two of which were in COVID.

So it has been a little bit of a journey, if you will, more of like an experiment, to be honest with you. But I've spent a lot of time in higher ed. I was in a community college system for about 17, 15, 17 years and worked my way through all the sides of the house I taught. And then I also worked inside Student Affairs, and I'm a transfer student myself and I'm a first gen student.

And so those two things combined are like really hard. And I beat a lot of odds. I feel like I've climbed Mount Everest a few times in my life. That's sort of my life's journey. And motto is like, how hard can it be? really hard. You keep going.

But was given an opportunity to take on this role and work closely with our VP of Student Affairs and our provost at the University of Wyoming and really who are connected and cared deeply about student success.

And so I've been able to literally just home grow some really important values and concepts at this institution which are supporting students and their success. That's all I get to do. And so really promoting and supporting our VP of Student Affairs, Kim Chestnut, she's amazing. She's doing incredible work and getting to work alongside her and then a lot of my other colleagues as well.

But being the first in my title, it's an inaugural position at the institution, so it's something that has never existed before. And co-creating and inventing with the provost and the VP and our dean of students and our alumni affairs folks,and creating a wonderful division of student affairs that support students. But my job also straddles academic affairs, which is really cool.

So I get to kind of do both. I get to work inside academic affairs and work closely with our faculty and talk about how we make success for students in the classroom and then outside of the classroom as well. So that's kind of my job in a nutshell.

My partner also works at the institution and she is on the other side of the house, which is finance and not as complicated and not for me.

So we're actually both doing great things, but just in different ways. And finance is not my jam, so I'm staying real far away from that and

get to raise a beautiful family. Have twin 12 year old daughters who just played soccer in New Mexico. So I've been traveling a little bit and excited to just show what we have and share with you.

Like how do we make better partnership and how is union kind of paving the way for success as well? I love that. Yeah, Well, I like how she described her three years. I that's what I meant. That's what that meant. That's what I meant. Way to save her. In a way to say what I meant. Yeah. And let's go first. Jen Love that. So, yeah, I love that. And that's Jen, too, so I love it. I was like, She's so passionate and you get to be creative, you know? And I love that aspect compared to what your partner does. No offense, but I wouldn't be in the backseat, so.

Yeah. Yeah. No, it's such a, it's a dream job, literally.

And it has been something really incredible. We just built this amazing peer mentoring program and it's just awesome and they had these headphones for me, so they were downstairs doing some of their own work and I'm like this Perfect, you guys helping me out every minute of the day. So that's great. So yeah, the student success program, I believe that's what you guys are calling this, right? And this is the second year that the university has done this, if I'm correct.

Yeah. So this so we created Student Success and Graduation Hub in 2020. So we were kind of the first cutting edge, if you will, along other institutions, but really kind of setting the pace for Wyoming as it's the only university. And we're really concerned about our students having access to higher ed, continuing through equity gaps throughout their college career and making a difference.

Right. Getting whatever their goal is. But by the time that they graduate and go out and find their amazing job that they want to work in. So it's been in existence for about three years, but we're called the Student Success and Graduation Hub. But we really focus on the institutional wide retention, persistence and graduation rates of all students.

So it doesn't matter what your major is, it doesn't matter what you're coming in for, it doesn't matter what your test scores are. We're here to support you all the way through.

My goal is to focus on undergraduate because I think there's a lot of students that have graduate program opportunities and we have a dean for those students as well. But this has really been a project that's focusing on like how do we close the equity gaps around retention, How do we make sure our students are graduating on time? You know, four or five years with less debt and understanding like affordability and working closely with the financial models and making sure students have access, but supporting them. Right, like building community and talking about you belong here regardless of where you come from, regardless of your background, regardless of socioeconomic status, minority status.

We care about every single student that says yes to the institution. That's our goal. And so we're really supporting them. We're inviting them to things. Right. post-COVID, I think students have really struggled with making connections and feeling like they're a part of something and being, you know, isolated really. That's really what it comes down to. I think we all felt that a little during COVID and so have been really trying to just, you know, challenge my own barriers, what I went through as a student, but then also what it would have been like to be like a student and in COVID.

And so I have a mental health background. I'm a counselor by trade. I've worked in multiple areas, but my master's is in therapy and have really tried to strengthen the opportunity that exists with our students to build community and talk about it's okay that you don't have all the answers. It's okay that you might feel like you are challenged, but like we're supporting you and you just need to know those and we just have to meet together to figure out what we can help support you with along the way.

We also talk a lot about data. We talk a lot about what does data do for us and how does that data inform what we're doing. Because data driven doesn't always mean that that's the right answer. But data informed and talking about like we know our students are struggling who are first gen we know students in Wyoming who come to a big institution for the first time are struggling. And so how do we support them?

So that's kind of in a nutshell in the last three years, and we call ourselves the Student Success and Graduation Hub. And it's the first stop where if students should go, if they are struggling or parents are struggling, we're building a huge parent program that's supporting parents of first gen students. But all parents as well, like my parents had no idea what it was like to go to college.

They were like, Yeah, good luck. And still, even today, they're like, What does that even mean? I'm like, Well, it just means that I'm out here supporting other people like myself who didn't know what to do or didn't have someone guiding them through the financial process or talking to them like their first F on a test or their first breakup.

Right. And so that's part of what I get to do, is navigating all of those obstacles and wrapping our hands around, helping students.

Yeah, I love that speaks so much to me. I was a part of a similar program in school being first Gen and I was on the other side of it. I was part of the mentoring, like I mentored the first gen students and there were a lot of transfer students and that alone is just so isolating, especially coming from a rural community and to a larger populated place. I mean, my dorm, I think, had more students in it than the town of Kima. So, you know, like it was just a total shock. And I love that you hit on that. You know,

I was a top of my class and then I took these courses and I'm making a five on a test. How is that happening? You know, why is this happening to me? And then I went through something very traumatic my first semester, I lost my father. And so you're already isolated. You're already going through these struggles. And then all of a sudden I had this huge thing happen to me and most of my professors were like, You should take a break. You should leave.

And I'm like, No, statistically, I will never return, so please let me stay. And so hearing you talk about that, I relate to it so much because I've been on that end. So I could not imagine sprinkling COVID into that. Like, I just don't know what I would add. I figure I mean, I'm a roll with the punches kind of gal maybe out of figured it out, but I can't imagine the emotional gap there with those students where they're already feeling ABCDE.

And then here comes this, and then they're trying to navigate it. So I really love that this program has really bloomed here, especially with the mental health in Wyoming and being one of the top, you know, states for suicide. You know that it's a big deal and we need these type of programs. And so the fact that the university is taking action and moving forward, that is just amazing.

I think. Yeah, I would agree.

Well, yeah, when you talk about COVID, you know, I mean, humans are made for connection, right? And especially when they're going through a transitional time, they really need that connection. And so I can only imagine, like you coming into your role and here is, you know, one of these huge life experiences that who knows how to deal with it. No one knew what to do. Right.

So I applaud you for getting through that. And what do you think the difference has been since you started that during like the pandemic, now that people can get out, like how have you seen the program evolve?

Yeah, Myra and Tressa, first foremost, we couldn't do this work without partnership, like you guys. And the story that you just offered, Myra is incredible and I applaud you for your bravery and your commitment to education. I think, you know, one of the biggest things that struck me was I was also given this job in March of 2020. So March of 2020, talk about like a big like hurdle like this is like one of those Mt. Everest things I get to do in my daily life. I guess it's like if there's a challenge, like, give it to Nicole, she'll figure it out and make the impossible possible. Sometimes I feel like. But, you know, we were sitting around in my garage and I was like, I don't I really have no idea. Like, this is going to be really hard. We just sent like thousands of students home and how are we ever going to get them back here?

How are we ever going to be like, Hey, we care about you, We want you to know that this is really important And like you just spent a lot of money and we're here to support you. And so we created what was called cowboy coaches. And and that's the program that you're all kind of working through right now. And this is that peer mentoring program. And it's like this one on one, peer mentoring, counseling, kind of like ish program. It doesn't do therapy, right. But the idea is that you have someone who's connected to you building all of these things together and really talking through like, Sorry, my phone just rang. Do you see all that? That's exciting.

No, no, no, no. It's. It is. Surprise, surprise. It's my kids. They don't have school today and so I didn't give them the warning to not call me like you did with your family. It's just really smart. Yeah, but we really were trying to be inspirational to say if I were sent home, who would call? Like, does anyone actually care? And so we brought o this like, small group. I started with five students that wanted to help peer mentor, and it just said like, we have no money. Like, I don't know how we're going to do this, but we got some startup funds from the VP of Student Affairs and she was like, okay, I trust just go and so I paid these students hourly to make phone calls to every student we sent away and just literally talk to them on the phone and just say like, How's it going? What do you need? How how can we support you? We're going to come back in face to face and it will just be a matter of time and we can't wait to see you. And then, you know, it was kind of disheartening for a minute because I was like, I don't know when we're ever really going to come back.

Right? COVID just sort of kept lingering and was there and it was really hard. And so we then kind of turned it over to the students and I said, You guys are the experts. You're the ones experiencing this. I only know tangentially because I am now. And I'm like, you know, I'm a profession. I work in this space.

And so this is part of what I want to do. But you tell me and I kind of almost wanted to give up on the program. And to be honest with you, these five students were like, We're not giving up on this program. Dean, Kourtney, like you have done everything possible to make this work, and I want you to be like a part of it.

And so we went on and they created this program where now we're seeing incredible results, right? So now we're seeing students who come in for cowboy coaching actually are getting the benefits of retention. So last year we first ran some data. We saw students that visited their cowboy coach one or more times, retained that 98%.

And so they are finally feeling connected to humans and they're seeing the results.

And we're doing like surveys, like what is it that you like about seeing your cowboy coach? What are you needing more of? And they're things like, I need more time with my cowboy coach so I can learn study skills. I just want to talk about relationships or I just want to get connected.

But our students are, you know, doing this work because of the work that you guys have provided back to us. So Union has offered to help support mental wellness, and all of our cowboy companies are now trained. my gosh, you guys, everything is blowing up in my fridge because I've had no heat in my office. gosh. Seriously.  my goodness. So sorry. That's okay.

And so they were, you know, so so those students are now saying, like, this is what we're building, This is what's so great about it, and we're just seeing results.because of the work you guys have dedicated to us, every student is now doing battle first aid, mental health, wellness training. And so we're paying them to go get this training that is providing one on one support to see these signs or symptoms. And what does it mean to like not be well? And so then they can physically kind of be the resource or the will, if you will, to getting them to or connected to the right space on campus.

So if it's something that the student feels like they can't handle, then we're getting them to the right place, like counseling centers or to the student health center. But if it's something like, you know, I filled my first test and I really don't know what to do, I need support that cowboy coaches right there connecting them to real resources, talking about note, taking, you know, talking about even just like, how are you studying? you work still to me. And that could be real challenging. So how do we talk about like, you know, maybe thinking about working on campus within your schedule, etc.? So it's a it's a work in progress. It's changed every year. It's not been consistent yet. We have our second year right now being a lot more consistent, but it morphs because student's needs morph and so do our demographics.

So do you apply for this program? Are you placed in the program?

that's a great question. So you can apply to be a cowboy coach, but you cannot be a freshman. So you have to have had at least on your experience and it is a paid position. So all of our coaches are paid and we have some grad students, but we also have a lot of sophomores through seniors.

And then every student that participates in this program called Saddle Up, which is our orientation. Welcome back. Academic Academy. They have to be here for one week prior to the school starting and we build in some they take a class together, they build communities together, and then they're introduced to their cowboy coach for the rest of the year together.

And those students are then placed in by major with our cowboy coaches. So a cowboy coach might be, you know, an engineering major. And so they would only get engineering students assigned to them. Well, that's very cool. I love that you're evolving, though, right? Because everything is an evolution.

So these are these are mentors who can help them with academic or non academic issues that they're experiencing.

From what I'm hearing from you, I love that. Yes. Yes or no? Absolutely. You have to. Right. Because I think, you know, you can never I think I heard you say this earlier, trust like, you know, if you're going to work at union, nothing stays stagnant. Right? Right. You can't Yeah, you have to be capable of meeting the market, talking to the customer and our number one customer is our students.

And so how do we ask them to help us guide and know what they need? We just ask. That's who they are. That's what we should be doing. And so we're very students entered. But yeah, you're right. There are so many ways. What do you think is the top reason for like freshman or any student for attrition or drop out at the University of Wyoming?

That's also a great question and something I think we're all still trying to figure out and struggle with this summer. We also pay our cowboy coaches to stay through the summer and part of what we do is we do callback campaigns and so we spend the entire summer talking to students who have been here, like in the spring, right?

But they leave for summer and they're not registered for the fall. And so something we've done is really spend some time dialoging with those students via phone because we want to be personally connected to them and we want to say, Hey, what's going on? Like what? What resource do you need? you're financially struggling. Okay, here's some micro grants. of the really cool things we were able to do in the last year is create some small micro grants to help students who are seeing peers get across the finish line.

And they had some small financial hurdles. And so we created some micro grants for some of those students. Some of them are feeling like they don't belong, right?

So still that support mechanism or my mom and dad really needed me back at home. And so we're still trying to like then have that conversation about, well, why you're at home, you know, you could do these classes online or you could be thinking about coming back in the fall. So it's financial to some extent, but a lot of it is, you know, students are good consumers.

And so what they're what they're doing is also they're consuming the rest of the world. So if they can get the class somewhere else, they're looking somewhere else.

It could be anything from just like I don't feel like I belong or I don't have a community financial or like, I need my results right now, right here. Right. And so some of that is also like, we got to be quicker.

We got to be ready to navigate their challenges right there then in that moment.

And that's something that we're working through as well. That's cool. So I was a freshman ten years ago and it's really neat to hear all the things you're talking about are all the things I felt, all the things I had to work through as a student.

 Those things that haven't changed. I mean, it's basic human, essential needs, the things that they need at this age. And so like the program I was a part of is very similar. And so when I applied to it, that was my driving force is because I saw all of these things and could help relate to them and work through with them.

And it's just wild to think they're still going through the same things. It doesn't change, you know, even with the generational difference, it's still some of the different, you know, the things that they're seeking out, the things that they're struggling with. My my mom needed me at home. So in order to finish my last semester, I end up taking summer courses and graduated early to meet the needs of something that my mom need.

You know, my parent asked of me. And that's hard because you're trying to make these decisions as a young adult that will impact for the rest of your life. But you're also have a parent or a family member who's saying, I need you. So how do you emotionally and how do you emotionally navigate that? You know, because it's like you're are you selfish or are you not self, you know, So those things, they don't change.

And so that's really interesting to hear how the program is still helping navigate that for students today. Yeah, it sounds like the core needs are still there. But one of the things that Nicole said I found interesting was generationally, though, the younger generations do expect things in immediate times, right? Because, Meyers already shared my age now because, you know, we talked about that earlier, but, you know, we ordered something and waited a week for it to arrive or possibly even longer than that.

Right. That isn't the way that the world works today. So they're used to that instant gratification, that instant result. So I found that interesting that you commented on that you guys are having to speed up their whatever their needs are. You're having to meet those immediately or very quickly these younger generations.

Yeah, that's I think that is part of the challenge.

I think that's part of our you know, I think that's part of what our own country is struggling with in its in its own way, right. Not just in higher ed, but I think instant gratification and that things take time to turn into something really beautiful. And I think the same is true. It can be applied in higher ed.

I think one of the things that we try to really work on with our students is like the core value of like, you know, it's okay to draw some hard thing. It's okay to have stress. Like stress is not bad, right? It's it's part of the healthy human system. It's how you manage it and how you deal with it is really important.

And so we spend a lot of time doing trainings with these students over and over about like, you know, how do you also have your own mental health and how do you also it like you're taking on someone else's kind of world? And so how do you also help kind of help those students that might need help as cowboy coaches?

And so we spend a lot of time working with them and building them up as well because they're going through things very similarly. And so I think insight gratification is just something we're always trying to combat. But, you know, a lot of things take time and growth and so it's okay and your brain needs some time to grow and develop as well.

And that's why those first four years are critical. But those basic human skills are something that will never go away. I think it doesn't matter if you go to college, you go to trade school, you go to anything. You know, life doesn't stop when you turn 18, actually probably sort of happens. And so we want to embrace all of those things and let people know that it's normal to experience hardships, to experience life.

And sometimes you have to just step away and sometimes will be here when you're ready, regardless of what that situation might be. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Well, we really appreciate you joining us today, Nicole. It's been a beautiful conversation.

We're starting something new because our podcast is called Authentic Wyoming. So we want to ask one final question and we want to ask you, how do you stay authentic?

I love that question, ladies. you know, I think it just goes back to like my own core values, which are, I wouldn't be where I'm at today if it wasn't for faculty member at my community college that told me, like, you can actually do what you want to do. You can be who you want to be. And regardless of the barriers you're face or the things that are kind of holding you back, go and do and conquer. And and so for me, that's really how I see authentic is just to continue to build and pay it forward. Right? That we all have things that are in our way. We're all fighting battles, regardless of what day it is.

And so all I'm trying to do is just help make sure someone understands that you don't have to do it alone. You have people here to support you and that as a community, we can't do it alone. Right? And so these beautiful partnerships that you guys are offering is something I'm never going to take for granted. And I think that's how we stay authentic, right?

Is that we just go back to those core values that I want to pay it forward and I want to help make the world a little better place each day. Yeah, I love that. That slowly takes a village. And I believe that, yeah, no one can do it alone. So awesome. Thank you so much. We appreciate it.

Thank you. Thank you so much for partnership. And hopefully, maybe next time when you bring the back of the phone, the backbone, I'll be there too. Yeah, You can be in the app. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Recruit you for next April. Yeah. There we go. Yeah.

Well, thank you so much, ladies. 

Thank you. 

Until next time.

Stay Authentic.